CHANGE REQUEST |
Request identity number: |
C00095 |
Applies to: |
S01432, S01433, S01434, S01435, S01436, S01437, S01438, S01439, S01440, S01441, S01442, S01443, S01444, S01445, S01446, S01447, S01850, S01851, S01852, S01853, S01854 |
Type of request: |
Technically new |
Request status level: |
Resolved |
Proposal: |
Include the listed symbols covering neeeds for alarm systems in the database. The symbols are mainly intended for use in installation diagrams, but some of them might as well be used in e.g. circuit diagrams.
The proposal is submitted by the Swedish Electrotechnical Committee. The proposal was originally submitted to 3A/WG2 for inclusion in the Task II, but this did not happen until the WG was disbanded. The original proposal is attached below. It contains a few more symbols than those listed above, but these are to some extent already covered by the present content of the database. If the VT find it relevant more of them could be included.
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Comment 2007-10-08: As a result of the work in PT 30 the symbols S01850 to S01854 have been added.
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Reason: |
Detectors and devices for alarm and signalling systems are until now poorly covered in the publication. On the other hand it is known symbols exist in some National Standards, and the proposal here may conflict with those.
The further processing of this propsal may therefore require some additional preparatory work. To carry out this it is suggested:
1. please inform about such standards;
2. propose experts for setting up of an ad hoc group to solve preparatory issues on this proposal. (These exparts may or may not be part of the VT, but should anyway be prepared to work electronically).
Because most of the symbols are new, it is expected that the extended procedure might follow the preparation work.
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Requested by: |
TC3 Secretary
pasv@pasv.se
SE |
General comments: |
Extended procedure: 3/900/CDV. |
Comments at evaluation: |
Submitted for evaluation 2002-07-08.
DE(RESC): There seems to be a need for this type of symbols. I would like to refer to some old SC3A-docúments: 3A/458/CD and 3A/468/CC as well as to the minutes of the New Delhi meeting. We will try to convince an expert to participate in that work (extended procedure) as suggested by the secretary. (Comment by the Secretary: The relevant documents have been attached below. 3A482RM-EXT is an extract from the minutes of the New Delhi meeting.)
AT(WGAS): In Austria are different symbol standards for alarm and signalling systems in use.e.g.:
1.)F2031 Graphical symbols for fire protection maps (plans).
2.)TRVB Technical standard for fire protection.
TRVB is required by the Austrian fire preventing authoity.
I will send this standards and some common symbols for alarm and security systems in a seperate E-mail to Mr. Svensson. The Austrian National Committee will further try to send a with austrian experts harmonized collection of symbols until February 2003 to Mr. Svensson. Regarding to the Swedish proposal we give no comments until all national standards are presented and ready for discussion. (Comment by the Secretary: For ease of access I have attached the referenced documents below as AT-Teil 1, AT-Teil 2, etc.)
JP(HIKE): The CR should be handled in extended database procedure. Japan has no technical comments at this stage.
DK(KATH): Denmark is planning to supply an expert for the working group (by mail) (Comment received by mail and entered by the Secretary.)
SE(KGSU): We are in favour of a working group (by mail). Sweden is planning to supply an expert for a working group (by mail). In Sweden we have a handbook written by members in TK 215 that is freqvently used. It is a mixture of old and new symbols.
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Conclusion by the Secretary: This proposal will be continued in a project team. AT, DE, DK and SE have indicated their willingness to supply experts for this group. A mail will be distributed regarding the setting up of the team.
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Document 3/657/PT has been circulated defining the Project Team PT30.
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Comment 2007-10-17: Document 3/864/CD including the symbols S01851 to S01854 has been sent for circulation. The other symbols in the proposal are not yet dealt with.
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Comments at validation: |
Comment 2008-03-03: The compilation of comments, document 3/896/CC was circulated 2008-02-29, suggesting the circulation of a CDV.
Document 3/900/CDV was prepared for circulation 2008-03-07.
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Comment 2008-09-17: The compilation of votes and comments of document 3/900/CDV was noted but the result will be further prepared and discussed in PT30 before it can be circulated.
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Comment 2009-07-08: PT 30 have discussed the comments to the CDV and delivers following answer to them:
1) S01851 “Heat”.
Graphics in symbol ISO 7000-0535 "Transfer of heat, general" is suitable for symbols on equipment but we think it is too complicated as base symbol for heat detector in diagrams.
ISO 14617-15 suggests the use of the Greek letter T, but graphical symbols should be independent of language, so we should avoid using any letters as far as possible.
2) S01852 “Smoke”.
ISO 14617-15 X3132, X3135 uses letter "S" or flash symbol. Usually flash symbol represents a fault in electrical system or dangerous voltage. Referring to standard ISO 81714-1 and definition of graphical symbol that say it should be independently of language we think the letter shall not be used. Furthermore the shape as in symbol S01852 have already been used in smoke detector symbols in some applications
3) S01853 “Flame”.
Graphics in symbol ISO 7000-0364 “Working flame” is suitable for symbols on equipment but in symbol for diagrams we think it is too complicated as base symbol for flame detector.
ISO 14617-15 symbol X3135 also uses letters (see comments above).
4) S01854 “Motion”
We propose to stick to the original proposal. The proposal gives the impression of something moving, whilst the ISO symbol 245 “Motion” used in example X3138 of ISO 14617-15 is a two-headed arrow, which rather shows a movement (back-and-forth). Furthermore similar shape as in S01853 is already used in some applications as part of motion detector symbols.
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Secretary comment: A FDIS based on the CDV will be circulated. |
Voting at validation: |
Secretary comment: The FDIS, 3/956/FDIS, was approved, see document 3/965/RVD. This means that symbols S01851 to S01854 will be released. |
Requested on: |
2002-07-08 |
Evaluated on: |
2002-09-18 |
Resolved on: |
2009-09-18 |
Withdrawn on: |
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Evaluation closing on: |
2002-09-13 |
Validation closing on: |
2009-09-14 |